Forums » Help » AppMobi/ImpactJS Sale

Hi there,

I have been looking at ImpactJS for a while, but being a teenager I can't actually afford it along with a Apple Developer Account (the reason why I was considering getting ImpactJS, making the whole exercise pointless :-D) . The sale price of $49 has made it a lot more attractive however!

My question is that if I bought the $49 ImpactJS standalone, would I be able to integrate it into the free version of Impact Game Dev XDK, albeit without the Cloud Services support? All I want is the ability to build an app through AppMobi (I don't have access to a Mac) and DirectCanvas support, which should help with performance a bit on older iOS devices.

If this isn't possible, is there a way to build a game in ImpactJS with DirectCanvas support and then compile that using the free AppMobi XDK? I understand that DirectCanvas has recently been made Open Source, so that should help.

Sure, you can use the XDK but the kicker is compilation; unless you have a Mac yourself, you will have to use the cloud services to actually perform compilation.

So you will have to spring for cloud services or buy a Mac.

Thanks - will probably use DirectCanvas then compile with PhoneGap Build then :-D

I've been doing some reading up, and building the app is actually free according to their FAQ- it is the other cloud services such as push notifications that require a subscription :-)

In that case, I'll probably buy InpactJS, use DirectCanvas/DirectCanvas SDK and compile using AppMobi :-)

That's not the understanding I had from Tyler of AppMobi; you can build using DC but you cannot produce a final compiled build without either using the cloud service or having your own ability to compile.

If you can build your own binaries completely with the XDK, it seems like I've been misinformed a bit then...

Quoted from http://www.appmobi.com/?q=node/151 (their FAQ page)

Q. What can I do with appMobi for free, and when will I have to pay?
A. We've made the process of developing apps using appMobi completely free. You can download and use the XDK to create, debug, and build finished binary apps for both iOS (IPA files) and Android (APK files) without ever paying appMobi a nickel.

To post your completed app to the app stores, you'll still need to pay the app stores for a developer account ($99 for Apple, $25 for Android).

appMobi makes its money by selling cloud services that support your apps. But even if you use our free XDK and build services, we don't force you to use our cloud services. We're betting that once your apps begin to get traction, you'll realize the value of our push messaging, in-app payments, over the air updates, and custom analytics, and will add them to your apps.

Either the FAQ is out of date, or something has gone wrong somewhere! :-)

I was primarily going off http://www.appmobi.com/?q=node/204

After all, if you can build your own apps, why would you need the cloud builds? More importantly why would you need 'unlimited iOS and Android builds for 5 game projects' if you can do your own free builds?

As far as I am aware, the ImpactJS license bundled with AppMobi is only a 5 game license (well, at least it is according to http://www.appmobi.com/?q=node/204). I'll try building one of my earlier AppMobi experiments (a pinboard app, for those who are interested) and see what happens. :-)

It does seem a bit odd though...

OK, so this evening I grabbed the XDK through the Chrome WebApp thing, and tried to build with it... and I can't do anything even approaching a build - even the 'new project' button tells me I have to register and pay.

I've followed this up on the appMobi forum, http://forums.appmobi.com/viewtopic.php?f=20&t=514&p=3721#p3721

I don't like the idea that it's being explained as being free when it really doesn't seem to be.

I've just read the posts - seems to have been very badly handled! So, you can't build using GameDev XDK when you already have the required components (ImpactJS, open source DirectCanvas) but you can in any other AppMobi product? That's the impression I get from the website, as quoted in multiple pages. What Ian is saying on the AppMobi forums, however, is that you can't build ImpactJS/DirectCanvas based apps even within their free XDK? *confused* - going to join AppMobi forums now.

There we are, a definitive answer...

_Quote from AppMobiIan
Open Source means code is on github and you are free to do what you want on your own. It doesn't mean it gives you free access to our products or tools that we host and automate.

So, we can't build using AppMobi (even though I'm pretty certain the FAQ says that we can build without paying!). In that case, I'll just borrow a friend's Mac and use the Impact iOS builder then...

Thanks for your help on this issue Arantor - I really appreciate it :-)

Funny, that's what I was trying to do before I gave the XDK a go (and I already own a Mac, but was lured by the promise of the apparent ease)

Still, it's clear that they have real problems given how the FAQ is saying one thing and the product is not the same as advertised.

I have actually sent Ian a PM, which I have reproduced below in its entirety. I think as far as appMobi goes, the phrase 'let the buyer beware' has never been quite so accurate :( There are more problems than the mere inconsistency attached to their free/paid definitions.

-----

PM:

[url=http://forums.appmobi.com/viewtopic.php?p=3733#p3733]Subject: Impact GameDev XDK[/url]

I have a question, then, since you've locked it despite the conversation getting towards something meaningful.

Your XDK is free, apparently. Yet I can't even click on 'New Project' without being asked to pay for it, which means that it would be rather useless except for the demos, and would seem to run counter to all the claims that the XDK is free, no? Or am I doing it wrong? (In which case, fix the documentation and provide pointers to it)

As I said, I'm not prepared to deal with an organisation that can't maintain consistency in the way they do things. Aside from the way the FAQ says one thing, and everything else says something different, the GamePro XDK's licence terms are ambiguous: if you're advertising the whole unlimited builds for 5 projects, make it clear that it's 5 projects per year if that's the basis of your licence.

That immediately brings me two problems: firstly, is it 5 projects per year? I don't know, but after asking Tyler on another forum, he suggested it was 5 per year. But I don't know, nothing on your website tells me that's the case. And if it is 5 per year, what happens if I want to start a sixth? Do I then have to buy a whole new licence?

But after this display of customer service... even if the customer is pissed off, don't confront them and make them more pissed off especially by stating something that wasn't correct without actually addressing the concerns that they have; I did not accuse anyone of lying, I stated that:
[quote]I'm not entirely sure what's wrong with the picture, whether the FAQ's blatantly inaccurate/misleading, or that the application is misleading, but it would be nice if the two different stories can be reconciled.[/quote]

One of the two is very misleading and/or flat out incorrect. I did not accuse your company of 'blatant lying', so please stop putting words in my mouth. Blatant lying is not the same as being blatantly misleading, because it could be very misleading through accident or simply not being kept up to date, it's only that it's so different to the message elsewhere that it is so blatant.

Protip for customer service: even if the customer is misinformed, when he has a complaint, he believes it is a valid complaint. Brushing it off with sophistry rather than trying to actually see it from their point of view will not win you customers.

Still, if that's the way you want to do business, making value judgements about a customer without any real basis, not to mention disagreeing with the marketing message you're putting out (which is 'use the app for free, pay for the cloud services', and that's something I was looking at in the future), I'll put up with the idiosyncrasies of iOSImpact, and I'll be sure to recommend and link to the public discussion for anyone who asks on the Impact forum (as well as posting this message publicly), since most of them will have bought Impact on its own and will not be particularly enthused about the details of this.

I don't know about you, but I find it important to do a bit of research on the companies I buy systems from, and I've done my research into appMobi's offerings and I can only conclude that no matter how good the XDK or even DC may be, I'm not willing to spend any time or effort, let alone money with them, because right now I can expect no better reaction than this from appMobi in the event I have a real problem.

Hey Guys,

As I told jhoyle, I guess the fact that AppMobi has many Man U fans, we've upset the UK developers :)

If you dig around the site, you'll see we have 3 XDK's. AppMobi, Phonegap and GameXDK. AppMobi XDK is free, where as Phonegap and GameXDK charge. They are laid out on each page what the charges are.

Ian

I was just replying to your PM on the subject; had you explained that rather than treating me as inferior, I'd probably have been a whole lot calmer and nicer about the whole thing. Every staff post on a forum is potential goodwill and PR if done right and can go a long way to building a relationship.

It doesn't help that while you have different pages about different products, the FAQ merely says "XDK", it doesn't say which XDK is free, and the 'hip' navigation is actually more confusing than helpful. I as a potential customer shouldn't have to "dig around the site", make it obvious and clear for me what your products are, why I should use them - and what the different options are and thus allow me to decide easily which is best for me.

Even a simple 'comparison of features' matrix would make a huge difference, and it would have been absolutely clear what I needed from that.

I'm sorry I got so annoyed, but I did state that I'd spent time getting annoyed with something first (and so probably not in the clearest of minds) and to be treated like an idiot isn't going to win me over. Your PM and this message did far more to win me over than anything else, let's hope it's the start of something productive.

Just had a couple of PM's off Ian that should (hopefully) clear things up.

Quote from AppMobiIan
Now, as to getting DC built apps working in the regular XDK. I haven't been given an official stance from that other then the GameXDK provides DC access and if people are not happy with that, the source code is available on Github and they can build the binaries themselves.

Quote from AppMobiIan
Missed your PM before. We're gonna change the FAQ to state about the GameXDK and PhonegapXDK being additional.

Good news about them changing the FAQ then :-)

~~
And peace is restored on the AppMobi/ImpactJS forums :-D

This is a message for anyone else who has issues/confusion about AppMobi.

If you are upset, just drop us a line and say "Hey, can we talk about something". Cooler heads on both sides prevail when it goes to something more personal like private messages or emails. We want to help you out. We'd rather have you understand our offerings and NOT use them, then be confused. We try to be upfront and transparent as possible, but sometimes our message is so spread out that we don't have it changed 100% to match everything else.

Additionally, we prefer to deal with these issues on our site. What Dominic has created in ImpactJS is really amazing, and we don't want to muddy up his site with anything from us.

Ian

Quote from stratman05
This is a message for anyone else who has issues/confusion about AppMobi.

If you are upset, just drop us a line and say "Hey, can we talk about something". Cooler heads on both sides prevail when it goes to something more personal like private messages or emails. We want to help you out. We'd rather have you understand our offerings and NOT use them, then be confused. We try to be upfront and transparent as possible, but sometimes our message is so spread out that we don't have it changed 100% to match everything else.

Additionally, we prefer to deal with these issues on our site. What Dominic has created in ImpactJS is really amazing, and we don't want to muddy up his site with anything from us.
Ian

Fair point - you have expanded massively in the past few months :-)
Also, thanks for taking the time to come over onto the ImpactJS forums and explain - it is appreciated!